tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post1230672611516483246..comments2023-10-22T05:51:58.898-04:00Comments on Soob: Challenging Anthropogenic Global Warming ConsensusJay@Soobhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12208597218366281778noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-90863718948162769252008-12-23T17:11:00.000-05:002008-12-23T17:11:00.000-05:00Do you mean that I attribute too much power to man...Do you mean that I attribute too much power to mankind in that I think that we destroyed the planet or that we have the ability to fix it?The Red Sonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13208734710414007893noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-37011717197202176542008-12-22T20:31:00.000-05:002008-12-22T20:31:00.000-05:00Beyond that which I think you attribute too much p...Beyond that which I think you attribute too much power to human kind, I agree whole heartedly.Jay@Soobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12208597218366281778noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-5964299441891591082008-12-22T07:23:00.000-05:002008-12-22T07:23:00.000-05:00I find it ridiculous that for DECADES we have know...I find it ridiculous that for DECADES we have known that we need to seriously address our degradation of the environment and change our foolish ways, but gas was still a dollar a gallon and beside saving the earth is for volvo-driving, granola-eating, weed smoking longhairs. But then the increasingly corpulent Al Gore makes a movie/powerpoint and all of a sudden everybody is going green. Only they aren't really, they are just reusing their shopping bags once in a while and recycling their Perrier bottles.<BR/><BR/>OK enough ranting (more <A HREF="http://therevolutionscript.blogspot.com/2008/04/new-environmental-movement.html" REL="nofollow">here</A>. Point being, regardless of whether or not climate change/global warming is real, WE GOTTA STOP FUCKING UP THE PLANET!The Red Sonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13208734710414007893noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-35065230239652020642008-12-16T00:38:00.000-05:002008-12-16T00:38:00.000-05:00"Additionally by focusing entirely on the "challen..."Additionally by focusing entirely on the "challenged" anthropogenic aspect of climate change we ignore the importance of contingencies that focus on resilience in the face of the very real possibility that climate change is something that we cannot stop but must adapt to."<BR/><BR/>That'd be my take on the whole situation. There seem to be very few (in the "mainstream," anyway) who are asking for a cost-benefit analysis of all of this. <BR/><BR/><BR/>"Lastly, as I've written here before, it's literally "stolen the thunder" of very provable and obvious ecological crises such as deforestation, destruction of wetlands, fresh water shortages, etc. None of these are reliant on computer models, indeed can be seen with your own two eyes. And yet most people seem to believe that if they simply drive a Prius and use energy efficient light bulbs then all will be well with the world."<BR/><BR/>Seems similar to the global movement against AIDS. Was reading an article a week or so ago that decried the massive amounts of attention and resources given to AIDS, when outside of sub-Saharan Africa it isn't anything close to an epidemic and when even there diarrhea kills more children per day. One of the public health officials quoted said something to the effect that you can't talk about diarrhea at charity fund raising dinners, it just isn't as sexy and hip as AIDS, but that these blinders were having real negative effects on the people these movements are ostensibly trying to help.Mikehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10122811314990661743noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-11428391793435373592008-12-14T10:13:00.000-05:002008-12-14T10:13:00.000-05:00I don't disagree with any of that. But I still co...I don't disagree with any of that. But I still consider myself a Gore-following AGW spear-chucker. And I'd also note that it's a lot easier to talk about adapting to climate change when you're the richest society in the history of humanity.Adrianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05953649845499754508noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-5966752135003562442008-12-13T22:04:00.000-05:002008-12-13T22:04:00.000-05:00Gents,A lengthy quote from the above cited:# Clima...Gents,<BR/><BR/>A lengthy quote from the above cited:<BR/># Climate policy in the past has been, with the limited exception of deliberate weather modification (see), focused on adaptation. Dams, zoning so as to limit habitation in flood plains, etc are examples of this adaptation. <BR/># For the coming decades, adaptation still needs to be the primary approach. As reported in the 2005 National Research Council report (Radiative forcing of climate change: Expanding the concept and addressing uncertainties) the human influence on the climate system involves a diverse range of forcings. Thus, a focus on controlling the emissions of carbon dioxide by itself (i.e. mitigation) is an inadequate approach for an effective climate policy.<BR/># Energy policy, however, clearly must emphasize an active management policy since a vibrant economy and society requires energy. However, all energy sources are not the same in terms of how they affect the environment and their availability. For example, the dependence of the United States, Europe and other countries on oil from politically unstable regions of the world needs to be eliminated.<BR/># The current focus of the IPCC and others on climate change with their emphasis on global warming, as a guise to promote energy policy, therefore, is an erroneous and dishonest approach to communicate energy policy to policymakers and the public. The optimal energy policy requires expertise and assessments that involves a much broader community than the climate science profession.Jay@Soobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12208597218366281778noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-43283189256572804432008-12-13T21:52:00.000-05:002008-12-13T21:52:00.000-05:00Dan,agreed that some good has come out of Al's new...Dan,<BR/><BR/>agreed that some good has come out of Al's new religion. The bad bit is it's placed blinders on policy makers and the general public.Jay@Soobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12208597218366281778noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-85979066607429785042008-12-13T21:45:00.000-05:002008-12-13T21:45:00.000-05:00Adrian, you should have dug deeper on that site. I...Adrian, you should have dug deeper on that site. It's a windfall of logical, scientific skepticism. You should give it a more in depth look.<BR/><BR/>Agree that the quote was conveniently clipped. However I'd say that if 650 scientists had been quoted out of context they'd be squawking rather loudly by now.Jay@Soobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12208597218366281778noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-33050925574437744232008-12-13T17:48:00.000-05:002008-12-13T17:48:00.000-05:00I'm skeptical about anything scientific that Senat...I'm skeptical about anything scientific that Senator Inhofe hosts on his website. So I just googled Joanne Simpson to see who called her a preeminent scientist. But what I found was much more interesting, the full text of that letter. It shows the wonders of selective quoting. Most of her letter talks about how the debate between the two sides has devolved into name-calling. But she also says this:<BR/><BR/>"Decisions have to be made on incomplete information. In this case, we must act on the recommendations of Gore and the IPCC"<BR/><BR/>http://climatesci.org/2008/02/27/trmm-tropical-rainfall-measuring-mission-data-set-potential-in-climate-controversy-by-joanne-simpson-private-citizen/<BR/><BR/>It'd be interesting to see how many of the 650 scientists had quotations taken out of context so that they could be fit in a list of skeptics.Adrianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05953649845499754508noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37179942.post-3165688478328711792008-12-12T18:13:00.000-05:002008-12-12T18:13:00.000-05:00My view of a lot of the AGW crowd is similar to my...My view of a lot of the AGW crowd is similar to my view of a lot of Fundamentalists-- much of what they say is ugly, but the natural consequences of their actions is good.<BR/><BR/>In the case of Gaia-worshipers, they are working to cut off funds to Venezuela, Russia, etc.<BR/><BR/>In the case of televangelist-watchers, they are pushing back against <A HREF="http://www.tdaxp.com/archive/2008/12/10/the-conservative-case-against-innovation.html" REL="nofollow">exotic legal instruments</A>.Dan tdaxphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07205344738190870766noreply@blogger.com